/sunflower/ - Sunflower

 >>/904/
Today I came to a realization after a meditation session with a goal. I was aiming to create a concise form intended to rationalize everything needed while staying as human in the world. As I went further I realized what I really needed was to create something which would unite the extreme astral meta form with the most mundane earthbound form. 
I found myself again trying to "wake up" using a backwards self hypnosis method, coming out of trance without entering trance. If being human is to be asleep, this should work.
I found that my body here is to be treated as a tool held in the hand of my true astral form. A sharp knife to be sharpened and multiplied as I keep practicing. But that is not enough. At one point I really need a final form.

That was what eventually became possible, and it took the shape of a stone tablet. While it does exist out there on the grey rock, it's also carved into a rock inside myself. I had not before experienced a portable rock like this.

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 >>/905/
This here is a sigil for a very specialized form of tablet created in a generalized form. These are conflicting ideas, specialized and generalized. Try to perceive it if you want an idea.
Someone may also want to use this exact form themselves.

It is a stone carving of a girl holding a knife.

 >>/905/
> At one point I really need a final form.
This is the realization I came to myself but I have an interesting problem. And that I don't need to create it. I need to find it. My first spiritual guide I found was deep inside me on a giant grey mountain at the top in a cave meditating. 

But now I had so many spiritual paradigm shifts... I will wait for my next insight before I experiment with this. If you need to register yourself to some place that will lock you into a form. I am not ready for that. But then again. My spiritual guide looks like my final form. I may need to investigate this similar mystery of mine further.

 >>/904/
I just remembered you talked about the grey rock years ago. But you didn't tell how did you find it first. What led you that place.

 >>/909/
I synced with it and grey energy flowed through me. I then noticed the same thing in the play Peer Gynt by danish writer Henrik Ibsen. He mentions specifically "back to the grey" when talking of being tired of existence and wanting to leave and return to the source.

 >>/910/
You probably know it if you hear it.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=YIk5oxSnrIw

Hall of the mountain king is very well known (starts at 24:15)

I played with the idea today. now I understand it conceptually. If you carve into "anti-existence" you make "existence". Like how a negativexnegative makes a positive. Even went there and carved into it. My guide told me it lasts as long as you don't "uncarve" yourself. Which means if you reverse the way and the force you carved yourself into it. You can change your form. It had an effect on my body too. Needs more experimenting but yeah it does something.

The concept of splitting things into existence and "anti-existence" like anti-matter is interesting. I didn't jump into this thing further yet. 

> coming out of trance without entering trance. If being human is to be asleep, this should work.
Can you elaborate on this?
Because to me "waking up" from the "flesh" means letting all the spirit leaving the body. But that is not the point. Life on earth happened because spirit somehow or some reason entered the material plane and things started to form around the energy (this is my current understanding). To me waking up from this world means that there are no more reasons to let the spirit attach to the body. Which can be the obv death. The other complete disconnection. Which is also death but now it's because of your complete will and not because the body stops functioning. Same thing but still different. Or also disconnecting but using an another "soul" to inhabit it till you are "away" so when you want you can return. I don't like these ideas yet because I aim to have my spirit have complete control over the body. And by that i mean the going to astral and "manifesting" at will full physical. I always thought of my body as the anchor of my consciousness. But you can either cut the chain and let the anchor stay wherever. Or you lift it up with the ship when you sail away. So many detail needs to be figured out.

 >>/914/
> went there and carved into it. My guide told me it lasts as long as you don't "uncarve" yourself.
Interesting. It looks like you manifested limestone and started carving into it as a test material. This isn't the real thing, which is kind of a given if it is reversible. The real granite rock cannot be mended once carved into, so you also cannot do it wrongly. It's just not possible to carve a non-eternal shape into it, all of it must be formed at once.
I think I'll try to manifest a rock of some softer quality also to see what can be done with that. It must be your feeling that you don't want to lock yourself in a form that made it this way.
> Can you elaborate on this?
You're making it too complicated.
If you enter trance during self hypnosis, you walk down 20 steps of a staircase into the basement which is your subconscious. When returning you walk up 20 steps.
So if you perform 20 steps up from already being awake, you are treating your waking state as a trance, based on the idea that your real self is up there, aware, while the human mind is asleep compared.
But how do you do this if you don't recall walking down the stairs? You have to recall the process and reverse it.

What about the zero particle of which you said will give us real immortality? Are they related? Or do you now think that the zero particle is not the ultimate immortality?

Also do I get it right that your "existence" (altought it's beyond existence) is carved into the stone once you realize or find your final form, and you don't need to actually carve anything like your name or your preferred astral body into the stone yourself?

I tought getting carved there is ultimately what the zero particle does but now I am not sure anymore.

 >>/1184/
I don't know everything about how these things work, of course. The zero particle is indestructible, but it's a formation made from material. How is it indestructible? I don't know, it seems to just be eternally stable this way, enclosed in itself. Any unique particle will itself also create an imprint on the grey stone slab, which raises the question if the zero particle is indestructible because it's referring to an indestructible record/carving. The stone slab is a collective formation, so with the moon being registered there, or the lyran starship destroyer, it's a registered "model". Anyone living within its reach can create one. A soul existing within the influence of a carving is also indestructible for this reason, which is why greys and lyrans are also unbeatable as races, while not seemingly so as individuals.
 >>/906/
The tablet here is another version, it's made from the same type of inverted stone, but personal, it's placed "within" your soul rather than outside. Creating a personal and unique zero particle will also create such a tablet.

All this is too conceptually odd to talk about before someone has a grasp of the basic ideas and some experience, which is why I never mentioned it earlier. You could aim to create a stone tablet directly, as anon here
 >>/914/
> I played with the idea today. now I understand it conceptually. If you carve into "anti-existence" you make "existence"
But I think it's better to just create the physical or mental idea and the stone will form naturally. You can aim to make a tablet like here
 >>/906/
but then you still lack the zero particle at first, and it doesn't make you immortal. The greys made the moon but were physically wiped out, so they are only immortal as an astral race with some physical access. What happens with New Nibiru is yet to be seen, perhaps the new greys are not the same as the old even if they look similar.

 >>/1185/
> Creating a personal and unique zero particle will also create such a tablet.
Are you sure? I mean is it by default that you will also have a tablet when you create the particle? And do I still need to carve something inside of it?

 >>/1186/
> is it by default that you will also have a tablet when you create the particle?
No. Most particles are not unique, especially not when created from following a collectivized egregore like cabal vampirism or Alissa who is an elemental. You'll be referring to their sigil carved into the rock "out there", which grants immortality just the same, but is not personal.

That's why this thread is about creating a tablet inside your own soul, which is specifically your own version. You can do this with Alissa directly and you will have a tablet with the same sigil in it, but this one is your own. Being this unique is kind of difficult though, few people can do it. It's more likely that the regular mass culture people are going to become immortal by following something like the moon, which is why those collective egregores are more known.

Here we aim to be those few elite practitioner who can do it though.
¯\(ツ)/¯

 >>/1187/
Thanks for explaining. One last thought...
> few people can do it.
Would you say there is even a point in it, except for proving to yourself how much of a elite practioner you are?
Isn't it immortality just the same? Or is there a difference that makes it worthwile to create your personal particle and tablet? Someone could get the mindset "I'll be immortal anyway, what's it to me if it's personal or through the cabal ergregore? It's carved in either way and will be eternal." and it would be good to understand if this is a mistake (or a bad deal) or not.

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 >>/1188/
It's about the same as asking for the difference between socialism and libertarianism. They give different types of restraints and different freedoms. For some people one or the other has restraints which are unacceptable to them. What we're doing here is more like build-your-own-dictatorship where everyone can be an elite. So maybe socialism with no workers if that makes any sense at all? There are different ways to understand things that look the same, someone could also say that is the same as libertarianism where anyone can have their own army. But is it? Telling people about the stone tablet is a way to share the possibility of being an elite, removing its exclusiveness. There are those who hate that, they think the value is only in keeping it away from people. I see it as a matter of skill level, not as a comparison between a large number of serfs and a small group ruling over them.

If this doesn't matter to you, it doesn't, then don't bother with it.

There is one last thing to mention though, stone artifacts have similar qualities, and this is gradually relevant for metallic artifacts. Some are still indestructible in the same way as the tablet form. In some way I want to tune this method to the extreme, creating artifacts with the same quality as those primitive tablets, while being refined like a "regular" material object. Sakuya's knives are supposed to be like this when done right, for one example. Touhous very well match this idea of everyone being their own dictator.

 >>/1189/
> If this doesn't matter to you, it doesn't, then don't bother with it.
No it matters to me, that's why I asked. I just didn't properly understand what the difference in immortality is for someone who is immortal through an ergregore vs someone who is immortal through their personal particle and tablet. I don't want to end up  thinking I have achieved immortality and freedom, when in fact there is an even higher immortality and freedom still attainable for me.

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 >>/1196/
> when in fact there is an even higher immortality and freedom still attainable for me.
Good. That's what this thread is for.

 >>/1196/
> when in fact there is an even higher immortality and freedom still attainable for me.
There is always a "higher immortality"
 When the vampires "acknowledged" my new "level" some appeared and started to explain me the "rules". There was a "don't kill rule. I was like how do I even kill an immortal? It's possible don't worry ;^) 
Also you either kill an immortal by understanding the "trick" that makes it immortal or by being a "higher immortal". But it's a dick move anyway. Don't kill immortals just because you can.
But it's always a good test to see just "how immortal you are" when being tested. A false sense of immortality is the worst anyway.

 >>/1208/
There are different ways to use the word "immortal", like some think jellyfish can be immortal, as in being able to regenerate cells endlessly. I consider it to be a matter of maintaining your personality as expressed in your specific incarnation eternally no matter how things outside changes. Being an immortal earthling loses its meaning once the planet ends and starts over with a new history, where your state of living isn't valid anymore.

 >>/1210/
> I consider it to be a matter of maintaining your personality as expressed in your specific incarnation eternally no matter how things outside changes.
I'm curious about this, its the reason I still haven't tried to become a touhou or something else other than vampire.
What happens to my personality and the way I think if I become a touhou for example? Would I be stuck with that touhou's personality in the astral after this body is gone?

If there's a change in personality, can I just use that body to have a foothold on immortality and then go on to create other bodies that can think and have the real personality that I want to have?

Speaking about the afterlife, do dead people still learn and evolve?

 >>/1212/
> do dead people still learn and evolve?
Depends on where they are, I think. It's hard to learn anything if you're just placed to sit against a rock in the underworld, or something worse. Maybe karmic repayment in hell is also a kind of learning, from one perspective.

Speaking about myself, most of my past lives where I finished the path, is one complete person now with the ability to freely travel between dimensions. I didn't understand that earlier, but I've actually met a few of my past me:s irl, they are "me" but humanly they are external to current me. My London life is weirder in that there are two "me" from then, one at age 9 and one older. There was such a change that my personality at that age enlightened and completed, while the lifetime wasn't over, so I developed two separate bodies and personalities.

My current life is so fragmented it's been "fulfilled" into a few different aspects already, those have been separated from the remaining me and are now on the astral or elsewhere doing whatever. I can will them here to possess my body and be them, but at the same time I know I have more things to do and will have tow work on whatever this incomplete me is. That's how Sakuya is on the astral independently of the physical "me" right here, there is development of skill, but perhaps not of the personality once it's fulfilled. Or maybe if your yin/yang set up is reversed from mine, there would be development of personality after leaving, while your skills were fulfilled as a human.

The Japari Park persona for example is just there, independent, but learning. I haven't intentionally done much with it, but it's still much more refined now than when I started those sessions.

where can I find information like this??? Can you tell me some books or other info??

 >>/1216/
Read the old threads on 8kun.top/sunflower/ and check the book recommendations in the library thread here and on there.

The rest is up to you to discover.

 >>/1212/
> What happens to my personality and the way I think
There is a great misconception here. The way we think or have a "personality" is usually because of our "environment" life experiences attachments and other emotional traumas (not always true our core being usually comes as we incarnate but it sure gets dulled by our life circumstances). Now you can advance with all that "baggage" but it will be slooooooooooooooow. Now if you can remove the baggage you will be fast. But when that happens you will feel like you deleted your whole personality! And you are not even thinking anymore! Weird huh? You will have dumb thoughts like omg am a mindles zombie now. But now you are able to ask your guides what to do and they will show it and you will know exactly where is the "way" you need to go. And after you "advanced" and feel like all those silly willy "personality" of yours is still so precious then... You can remember it's "settings" and remake it but from now on with your "immortal" being. And as you get enlightened you will adjust your thinking to that. Same thinking but improved to it's full potential.
Or maybe you realize how shit your personality was with your thinking too and make a new one.

Or you keep your personality and the way you think. But you need to have an excellent personality/thinking to be able to advance with it fast.

 >>/1229/
What exactly are you advancing towards? And how do you maintain any motivation or desire without a personality?

 >>/1230/
I strive towards my full potential. The greatest heights that might be attainable in existence. 
And understanding the mechanics of the universe so I can wield all of it's knowledge and power.

> And how do you maintain any motivation or desire without a personality
Now this is a real tricky part. We have our "core" personality. Which knows exactly what it needs to do. But we have to shave off everything else or our progress is slow. 

Also about motivation and desire... Well I either progress on the path or... I can live my life in this mundane hellhole with 0 wonders. There is nothing in the modern world that even worth living or fighting for. As I progress on the path I constantly realize how true it is. And no I don't want to go to "Nirvana" to watch the "paint dry" (it's an extreme bliss but boring). I want to realize my full power to see the full extent of what is "possible".

I don't know anything about stone tablets or anti-existence, but I tried to go beyond existence myself by more traditional means. It's obviously very hard, I find it is something like becoming undead all over again but on a different level. Unfortunately I mostly get stuck at the top of existence or I start to drift off into the hell of no-self and non-existence which is of course a grave mistake.
When you became undead, you had to enlighten to something. You had to go beyond the duality of life and death. You went beyond life and by default also beyond death, becoming "immortal" in the process. But it was not too hard because you could see that beyond was still existence, so you went beyond the duality of life and death and you still exist. You realized that duality was bullshit. Now I think it's the same with the duality with existence and non-existence. But  this is more like a plunge into the unknown, into the ultimate darkness since we usually cannot see what lies beyond to catch us safely. At least I find it hard to see beyond. The fear that you stop existing is imo bullshit because non-existence is a part of the existence duality which you will go beyond completely. Lust like the fear of death was bullshit when you went beyond life to become "undead". But then again what is there, and what will we be? I still struggle with how to actually go beyond existence and/or be beyond existence. I only feel like once you make the leap you will be truely eternal, and not even existence will be able to lord over you. You will be able to freely drop in and out of existence as you please. Who knows?